The not so baby, Baby Fox is born. [Archive] - Atomic Zombie™ Extreme Machines Builder's Forum

jimFPU

09-24-2008, 08:24 AM

I hope to have pics tonight, but I'm waiting on bearings for the Baby Wolf (scheduled for delivery 9/25) so I started the Baby Foxes-yes two of them!! This hobby is just turning out to be a blast!!

Anyway, I'm not putting suspension on them 'cause I don't want to spend the money on a new 'parts bike', and haven't found a suspension donor, so no suspension. No worries-these are for my kids and I'll build mesh seats for the comfort. Had them sit on the frame with the rear wheel and two jack stands to 'test' it for size. I cut the main tube at 4 feet instead of 6 and it fits just fine, possibly will even fit me if I put a long enough chain on. It seems to sit a bit higher than the pics of the suspended Fox, but that's OK for us as far as visibility goes.

I'll try and get some pics up later.

jimFPU

10-13-2008, 10:15 PM

Well, I've finally gotten around to taking some pics, but they are not of the origional build. I picked up 3 24" suspension bikes (Wally World used) two were twins. All for $110. Not bad I think. Any way, had one apart in no time and decided how I was going to make it the new SF. I'm just now attaching the rear triangle to the main beam, and this is the hack I used:
Took out bearings from donor and drilled and filed holes to fit:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00123.jpg
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00124.jpg

Then rounded the end of the tube:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00125.jpg

Test fitting:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00126.jpg

jimFPU

10-13-2008, 10:18 PM

Little burn through there!!
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00130.jpg

Adding the end cap:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00132.jpg
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00133.jpg

jimFPU

10-13-2008, 10:21 PM

Almost ready to weld everything up:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00134.jpg

Welded and sanded:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00136.jpg

Test fit is great!!
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00137.jpg

jimFPU

10-20-2008, 08:19 PM

Yet another hacker is born also!! My DS working on his Fox. Good bonding time...he didn't want to weld though. He has ridden the Baby Wolf, and is really looking forward to his Fox, so he wants to help get it done!!:D

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00146.jpg

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00147.jpg

greenevegiebeast

10-20-2008, 08:25 PM

Corupt them young, that way we feel younger. That way when we get commited we will have company.

TheKid

10-20-2008, 10:22 PM

Nice idea for the pivot. I ended up making a tube for mine, because the front of the donor frame is aluminum. Your method is much easier, and easier to align the front and rear frames. Thanks for sharing.

SirJoey

10-21-2008, 06:42 AM

Kool hack, Jim. WTG!

Nice to see you're breakin' the boy in right, too! :D

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/9206/signaturehalloweenvr0.jpg

AtomicZombie

10-21-2008, 11:04 AM

I bet that kickstand is not going to get much use now!

Brad

jimFPU

10-21-2008, 12:25 PM

Not once we got the front wheels mounted, but it was real handy before we had the front arms welded on and moved the jack stands out to the sides! It was a good day with my boy.

jimFPU

12-08-2008, 09:42 PM

Finally uploaded some more pics...as you can see we're not far now!!

Have to make the mesh seat, steering linkage, front wheel side/brake arms, add BB, cables, test and paint!!

Just need a few $$$ and some more time...maybe after Christmas.
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/StreetFox2.jpg

Same seat frame as the Baby Wolf:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/StreetFox1.jpg

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/StreetFox.jpg

Locutus

12-08-2008, 11:43 PM

I like how you've kept the front and rear deraileurs intact, both behind the seat. Will you be using a single sprocket crank to tie in from pedals back to the front deraileur?

TheKid

12-09-2008, 01:30 AM

That's how I had mine set up for a while. I had the front crankset on the left side, back to the left side mid drive, and the right side mid drive to the rear wheel. The rear wheel had an 8 speed casette, which gave me 24 speeds. I later put the front crank on the right side, and went to the mid drive, then to an 8 speed internal gear hub. I found it ran smoother and easier. I now have the front crank going directly to the rear wheel, which seems to have improved efficiency further.

SirJoey

12-09-2008, 08:12 AM

Man, that's really lookin' good, Jim.
Can't wait to see more!

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/539/christxsigsmalloq2.jpg

jimFPU

12-09-2008, 03:20 PM

I like how you've kept the front and rear dérailleurs intact, both behind the seat. Will you be using a single sprocket crank to tie in from pedals back to the front dérailleur?

Not sure yet. Just left it that way for now 'cause it wasn't in the way and it was easier...I was thinking of using the small sprocket for the front to mid chain and the upper two for the rear gearing...

Not sure yet.

rickairmed

12-09-2008, 08:22 PM

Jim if those are 3 piece cranks a left side drive would be pretty easy just add a sprocket to the left side and use it as the driven sprocket and keep all the gears .

Rick

jimFPU

12-09-2008, 09:49 PM

It's not a three piece, but I may try to add that on somehow anyway as I have taken the crank arm off that side. The side you see I had to cut the crank arm off...I like my angle grinder!!

TheKid

12-09-2008, 11:50 PM

Jim if those are 3 piece cranks a left side drive would be pretty easy just add a sprocket to the left side and use it as the driven sprocket and keep all the gears .

Like this? (The front crank had 3 rings because I didn't have short chainring bolts.)

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z66/edpol_photos/tadpole/000_0164.jpg

savarin

01-24-2009, 09:44 PM

Why not cut a set of side plates for the front deraileur and weld them on backwards to make a left handed version so you can use the three chain rings.
I did it on my low rider and it works great.
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s258/savarin48/recumbent/deraileru2L.jpg
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s258/savarin48/recumbent/LH-deraileurL.jpg

SirJoey

01-25-2009, 08:11 AM

Charles, I remember when I first came across your left-hand der,
quite awhile back, while surfin' the web. It's STILL the only one I've ever seen.
That is an original work of genius! Kudos to you, sir! :punk:

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/7131/sirjoeysigmedij1.gif

savarin

01-25-2009, 09:13 AM

jimFPU

03-05-2009, 08:46 PM

Thought I'd update my own thread since I tried to commandeer Joey's trike thread!!

Got some more done (finally!!!) We have a rolling chassis, will start looking for a pulley to get the chain hooked up for a true test ride with no brakes!!!:1eye:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00195-1.jpg

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/th_MOV00197.jpg (http://s353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/?action=view&current=MOV00197.flv)

Richie Rich

03-05-2009, 11:10 PM

Lookin' good, Jim....

And nothing broke or fell off (always a good sign..!!).

Press on......

......Richie....
.

Radical Brad

03-05-2009, 11:13 PM

Glides forever - steering must be right in alignment.

Brad

TheKid

03-05-2009, 11:46 PM

If you put a small chainring on the left side going to a small ring on the left side of the rear triangle, which creates a mid drive, you won't need a pulley to test it. You'll still have 21 gears,(I'm assuming that's a 7 cog freewheel) the 3 rings on the right side of the triangle to the freewheel. That's the setup I had on my Fox before I went to a internal gear hub. In the pic you see three rings up front, only because I didn't have short chainring bolts. I used the other rings as spacers. I used the 34 tooth up front to a 34 tooth to the left side of the mid drive:

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z66/edpol_photos/tadpole/100_0186Small.jpg

SirJoey

03-06-2009, 07:59 AM

If you put a small chainring on the left side going to a small ring on the left side of the rear triangle, which creates a mid drive, you won't need a pulley to test it. You'll still have 21 gears,(I'm assuming that's a 7 cog freewheel) the 3 rings on the right side of the triangle to the freewheel.Kid, I'm still planning this exact setup for my LWB bike, when I get to it.

First, I have to build a more basic version for my sister's birthday present, though.
In fact, I've already started hacking parts for it!

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/7131/sirjoeysigmedij1.gif

TheKid

03-06-2009, 09:18 AM

Kid, I'm still planning this exact setup for my LWB bike, when I get to it.

I take it you haven't received my package. I was assured it was sent a long time ago. I'll have to make a call and chew someone out. Sorry Joey, I'll make sure it goes out this weekend.

SirJoey

03-06-2009, 06:53 PM

I take it you haven't received my package. I was assured it was sent a long time ago. I'll have to make a call and chew someone out. Sorry Joey, I'll make sure it goes out this weekend.Wow, I'd forgotten all about it, Kid. Figured it musta gotten lost or something,
but yeah, I could still use that stuff for a mid-drive setup like you did on your tad.

It'll prolly be my next project, after the birthday bent for my sister.

Anyway, you shoulda known I wouldn't be so rude as to not even mention it, if you sent it! :)

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/7131/sirjoeysigmedij1.gif

jimFPU

03-06-2009, 09:10 PM

Well as good as it looked it just wasn't right...too much wheel flop in turns, huge turn radius, and very unstable in turns...

I reread the book, and found out that somehow I mounted the head tubes at the wrong angle...
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00199-2.jpg

http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00200-2.jpg

So after an hour or so of rework:
http://i353.photobucket.com/albums/r399/jnk6/DSC00206.jpg

I can even take a corner pretty fast now! It handles much better too! I think I'm going to eliminate the mid drive and go with Brad's method, but am not totally decided yet...stay tuned.

Oh yes, the book talks about having a lot of patience on this part. Buy more than that, 'cause you're gonna need it! LOL! Now I'm not so worried about doing another one though! BTW, the huge protractor is 75 degrees, and it makes a world of difference at a larger scale instead of eyeballing it with the little one...:dunce2:

GregLWB

03-06-2009, 09:59 PM

Kid, I'm still planning this exact setup for my LWB bike, when I get to it.

First, I have to build a more basic version for my sister's birthday present, though.
In fact, I've already started hacking parts for it!

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/7131/sirjoeysigmedij1.gif

Hey guys, I used to have a mid-drive setup on my LWB commuter bike and it worked pretty good (I could swap chainrings to step up or down depending on the terrain I was going to be riding) but I found that it wasn't as efficient as Brad's method and I changed my bike over to a single chain. After I changed it I was shocked at how much drag the mid-drive added. Just my two cents.

Greg

TheKid

03-07-2009, 12:06 AM

The Baby Fox is looking good.
I changed to a single chain also, but just suggested the mid drive as an alternative until Jim found a pulley.
Steering geometry is tricky. My Fox handles just great with only a little bit of caster angle, about 8°. I made quite a few changes along the way of building it, starting as a rear suspended tadpole before the Streetfox was mentioned. It had kingpins angled at 15°, with 12° of caster, and perfect Ackerman.
I ended up with just a tad of toe-in and a slight bit of anti-Ackerman before switching to the head tube steering system. My crossmember is more obtuse than the Streetfox plans, which I made before the plans were available. After switching to the steering tube system, I found that with the angles already built into the frame, the toe-in and anti-Ackerman gave the best handling. Now I found another problem. One of the pivot bushings broke into little pieces, and the entire rear is on an angle. That's why it was getting harder to pedal than the DR. But I have a new hub motor, and will start making a new stationary rear end for it this weekend.

jimFPU

07-03-2009, 04:09 PM

Well the Baby Fo is no more.

See the updates in the Maraurder pages!!!

http://forum.atomiczombie.com/showthread.php?p=26860#post26860

Buffo

07-05-2009, 07:44 PM

Jim,

Looks real good. Keep those photos coming!

I haven't used a "sling" seat yet, but I'm just wondering if it would be a bit stronger if you extended the two outer seat rails and fastened or welded them to the front cross member(?). On fast, sharp corners there will be a bit of lateral force on the seat frame. The two centre welds, especially with the thin seat tubing, may crack with the constant flexing. Just a suggestion.

savarin

07-05-2009, 08:11 PM