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darnthedog
10-29-2008, 08:40 PM
After much reading, practicing welding and gathering parts i have finally started on my DeltaRunner. I have been working a few hours everyday for the last week. I tacked and welded and ground down and re-tacked re-welded and ground down. I still did not get it completely right. I am using a wire fed flux core mig welder. And I seem to have not gotten every thing straight. However the Axle can be made level with a couple of spacers from 1/8 inch metal on each end. My issue seems to be the main boom did not stay level even though it was clamped flat and level to a table:eek:. Take a look

Richie Rich
10-29-2008, 09:58 PM
Hi, 'dog'....Welcome to the AZ Krew.

The high heat generated during welding is both a positive and a negative. You need the heat to fuse the parts together, but at the same time, the metal can warp. It appears that this is what happened to you.

Even though you may have clamped the pieces to your work table, warping can still occur. The best way to avoid this is to weld in short spurts and don't weld in a continuous line around the tubing.

In other words, do a small section, stop, do a different section on the opposite side, stop, and continue like this until all sides are welded. After all sides are 'tacked', then you can go back and fill in the blank areas.

By using this technique on all of your welds, you'll have straight and true joints.

Best of luck with the project and be sure to keep posting pix of your progress.

.....Richie Rich...
.

greenevegiebeast
10-29-2008, 11:00 PM
Dog dont worry about it I suffer from a little warpage to(actulay i didnt suffer I enjoy it alot:D)

savarin
10-30-2008, 09:21 AM
It also looks as if its warped rearwards as well as downwards in that last section.
If you have a gas torch try heating the side of the tube facing to the rear and the bottom of that tube as well.
The idea is to expand those sides forcing the tube to re curve back into place.
Some times this will work.
If it doesnt then get that part red hot and use clamps/levers to twist it back to fit.

darnthedog
11-05-2008, 07:39 AM
Well after the comments a little more reading I ground down the welds and straightened up the frame this week. I took all the suggestions and essentially tack welded allowed it to cool and repeated. I also clamped an extra tube across the ends to hold it while welding. Worked much better than clamping to a table. Now onto the hubs. I am having another fun time 1) getting them to be round and 2) Keeping them over 2.25 inches. First attempt had me down to 1.5 inches. May have to resort to using flat washers. But the good news is I was able to create a template for drilling the hubs using the emachine software. Having them build them for me is out of the question with an over $200.00 cost. I will fight the hubs myself. Machine shops are expensive these days. Anyway the picture is of the latest attempt to build the hub. I used a 2 3/4 hole saw for the outer and then grind it round and a step drill to take it to 3/4" my chosen axle size. At the time of collecting parts I was 265 lbs and going up. But since starting to ride to work I am down to 219 lbs. and heading down. Loss is intentional due to recent diagnosed health issue. If I get it down under 200 the Doc say no more pills needed. At $65 a script every month you bet I'm going to loose the weight. Oh and the loss is spread out from May to today so don't sweat the speed of loss. I have been riding a Walmart special. But wanted a more comfortable ride. $4500.00 wasn't for me with a new recumbent trike. So I went on the internet a found several home built idea when I came across this site. Since then have been an avid reader of the forum ever since. Anyway thanks for the encouragements.

SirJoey
11-05-2008, 08:43 AM
Way to go, Dog! You're on the right track now!
Just think, when you can lose the script, that's $65 more you can put into your rides each month!

Your work looks good, BTW! Keep it up!

http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/2839/thanksgivingsigsmalllu5.jpg

TheKid
11-05-2008, 01:08 PM
Congrats on the weight loss. Keep up the good work on the DR!

John Lewis
11-05-2008, 08:39 PM
Sounds all good. Progress made on all fronts.

Guess you've watched Brad's little video on doing the hub flanges.

I have made flanges this way.

Clean up the metal, coat with blue felt marker then use a compass to mark the disk. I make multiple cuts with a hacksaw to get it round as I can but still outside the scribed line.

Bring it down nearly on the line and finish with a file. I use the file because it is more controllable for me than the grinder.

I think you could chuck the disk on a bolt in the drillpress and bring grinder or file up to it while spinning to true it up. Sort of poor man's lathe. Not tried that though.

John Lewis

TheKid
11-05-2008, 08:55 PM
I think you could chuck the disk on a bolt in the drillpress and bring grinder or file up to it while spinning to true it up. Sort of poor man's lathe. Not tried that though.


I used that method years ago to true wooden discs. I put a rasp in a vice. the disc was held with a long bolt and nut, and the bolt was chucked like a drill bit. After the high spots were worn down, the rasp was brought closer and closer to the line on the disc until it was the right size.

savarin
11-06-2008, 01:19 AM
I've done it many times in a drill press, wood, aluminium and steel.
I hold the file against the pillar to hopefully keep it parallel to the work and off we go.
I've found that plenty of wd40 and a "magi-cut" file works excellently with ally and an ordinary (new sharp) ******* file for steel.
Slow speed works best for me.

greenevegiebeast
11-06-2008, 10:47 AM
I have a stupid question, what gauge of steel are you using for your hubs. I know I saw that some where now I cannot find it, I already bought 14ga. I have some 1/4in sheet stock as well. though the 1/4 in seems way to heavy.

Though I am building a trike to hold about 1/8th ton.:eek:

TheKid
11-06-2008, 11:49 AM
No more than 1/8" steel for the hub flanges, otherwise the spokes won't seat properly.

n9viw
11-06-2008, 01:23 PM
A note about using a drill press as a 'poor man's lathe'- not all quills are secured in their chucks, some are simply held in by press-fit, like a Morse Taper tool. If you put a side load on these, sometimes they can fall right out, likely while you're putting a heavy cutting pressure on the piece, leading you to make a huge gouge just before it falls off.

Also, cheaper drill presses don't have lower bearings, only upper bearings. If you use one of these a lot or heavily for side-load work, it can cause the quill drive to warp, or if it's supported by a bushing, it can ovalize the bushing, causing the drill to wander when using it for regular drilling stuff.

Just a few things I've picked up in my search for all things Gingery! :D

savarin
11-06-2008, 06:47 PM
good point nick, I had forgotten I used locktight on my chuck because it kept falling off under normal drilling.

John Lewis
11-06-2008, 07:51 PM
A note about using a drill press as a 'poor man's lathe'- not all quills are secured in their chucks, some are simply held in by press-fit, like a Morse Taper tool. If you put a side load on these, sometimes they can fall right out, likely while you're putting a heavy cutting pressure on the piece, leading you to make a huge gouge just before it falls off.

Also, cheaper drill presses don't have lower bearings, only upper bearings. If you use one of these a lot or heavily for side-load work, it can cause the quill drive to warp, or if it's supported by a bushing, it can ovalize the bushing, causing the drill to wander when using it for regular drilling stuff.

Just a few things I've picked up in my search for all things Gingery! :D

Yes, care needed. I have an "Oklahoma" planer thats basically a big router bit for the drill and it can cause the chuck to come loose. I've toyed with the idea of cross drilling and putting in a set screw.

Another alternative is to use a hand electric drill. I have a home made mount that clamps in a vice and holds the drill horizontal. All made from wood. It would be easy to make a simple tool rest of wood.

Going the whole hog. A pair of bearings, pulley, a piece of shafting, old appliance motor and one of those cheap far eastern X Y tables for a drill press and you have a simple lathe. I think any Krew member could cobble one up. I used something similar years back to build a model hot air engine.

All things Gingery. I've built a Gingery lathe and Shaper. Savarin is building one too I think.

Just ideas,

John Lewis

savarin
11-06-2008, 08:04 PM
All things Gingery. I've built a Gingery lathe and Shaper. Savarin is building one too I think.

Just ideas,

John Lewis

Yup! got all the castings done but thats all.
What John has neglected to mention is how awesome his machines are

darnthedog
11-10-2008, 06:40 PM
Well I gave up attempting to grind the hubs round. My latest attempt had my last set down less then 2.25". So I bought some flat washer from McMaster-Carr part number 91117A123. I used a Harbor Freight Step drill to open them up to 3/4 inch. (my axle size). Then attempted to align the 18 7/64" in a good alignment. What a trip. Looks so simple in the plans and by all the descriptions. The pattern which I drew up using emachine software kept slipping and my set point were all over the place. I thought lets try a transparency instead. Went to my local office supply and found something perfect for what I was doing. It is Clear Sticker project paper by Avery item 4383. Printed up my pattern then aligned up the pattern over the washer. They came out nearly perfect. The Avery sticker was self sticking and allowed me to remove and reset until I had it as good as I wanted. The only reason it is not absolutely perfect is when I punched it I was not absolutely center on my holes. Oh well a little slop just shows it is home made. I am also building my own disc brake adapter. That is the 5 flat washer on the picture. Check it out. I keep this up I am going to have to start a web page to allow all my pictures to be viewed. Now on to attaching them to the axle.

SirJoey
11-10-2008, 07:07 PM
Your flanges look good, Dog. Keep up the good work!

BTW, regarding it looking so easy in the plans...
remember, that's Murphy's FIRST law, "Nothing is as easy as it looks". :D


http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/2839/thanksgivingsigsmalllu5.jpg

John Lewis
11-10-2008, 07:07 PM
I use 3m spray contact cement. A quick light spray on the back of the pattern and likewise on the work.

Holds it all aligned and can be pulled off and repositioned. When it's right press down firmly.

I use a similar trick when silkscreening tee shirts. Quick spray on the work table. The fabric stays put when you lift or change the screen.

Nearly forgot to say. The flanges looklike they will fill the bill fine.
John Lewis

Richie Rich
11-10-2008, 09:17 PM
It is Clear Sticker project paper by Avery item 4383. Printed up my pattern then aligned up the pattern over the washer. Thanks for the tip, 'dog'. I have a pack of 'Clear Window Decals' made by HammerMill (it's similar to your Avery) and now I know just what to do with it. It's a good thing I never throw anything away...!!

.....Richie.....
.

darnthedog
12-01-2008, 10:42 AM
It is very frustrating to come so far and then get kicked in the rear.
I finished lacing the rear wheels. Both Rims are labeled Sun M13II rims 622 X 18. One is matt finish and the other polished due to one was a hand me down and the other purchased. Both laced up and 8 hours of truing them. Not to mention the 4 times of pulling them apart and replacing them due to operator failure. Also set back due to one wheels spokes were too short. Should have suspected then. Bought new spokes and laced up. Both wheels with in .05" all the way around. So I started mounting the tires. First one went on great. No problems and looks good too. I got 2 Specialized 29 X 2.00 tires. And I can't get the tire on the second wheel. Well I measured it finally after giving up last night and retrying this morning. Apparently the second wheel is mis marked and is a 27 inch and not a 700C per the label. What a bummer. Now I have to get another new rim. Oh well now I will have 2 polished rims.
I was hoping to have a finished rolling frame before my vacation ended.

Looks like I am set back a couple weeks. I guess I just have to get my seat built while I am waiting.

darnthedog
12-18-2008, 07:49 AM
Well my new rim is due to arrive today but I took time out to mount the freewheel adapter to the one axle. I don't know if I got it drilled crooked or what but it wobbles back and forth rather than spinning straight. And I used a drill press and cutting fluid when drilling it. I also got my Seat built. Got my Mom to assist in stretching the material over the foam. Learned a neat trick to cutting/trimming the foam. Used an electric carving knife, went through it like butter and worked great. Used Marine rated material so it could stand up to any rain. It is also white to attempt to stay a bit cooler during our 110 degree summers. Not sure what I am going to do about the freewheel adapter. I really need to get it to spin straight as I got a 14 to 34 tooth freewheel from Harris, what to be sure could push the 29" tires I am putting on the Deltarunner. Hate to redrill but I don't think it will stay in gear unless it is corrected.

Radical Brad
12-18-2008, 10:35 AM
Most of the freewheels I have mounted wobble when I spin the axle. The adapter is perfectly straight, though. I think they are made this way in order to aid with shifting so that the teeth bite into the chain. Just a guess.

Brad

comreich
12-18-2008, 04:46 PM
Is is the adaptor that visibly wobbles, or the freewheel on the adapter that wobbles? If it's the freewheel, the wobble isn't unusual at all. On a "regular" bike with a cassette, get the wheel spinning quite fast and then let it freewheel. You'll see the cassette wobble and rotate forward over time as well. If I recall, it happens a bit on my freehubs too. Nothing to panic over.

If it's the freewheel adaptor that wobbles, then I can't really help because I'm a long way from building something similar.

jimFPU
12-18-2008, 05:18 PM
Most of the freewheels I have mounted wobble when I spin the axle. The adapter is perfectly straight, though. I think they are made this way in order to aid with shifting so that the teeth bite into the chain. Just a guess.

BradAs I never knew that, and being Quality...after I tested one of my bikes...I had no idea!!! And I thought I had somehow messed up on the Baby Wolf, but it still worked so I wasn't going to mess with it any more!!! Glad I didn't.:punk:

John Lewis
12-18-2008, 10:14 PM
Most of the freewheels I have mounted wobble when I spin the axle. The adapter is perfectly straight, though. I think they are made this way in order to aid with shifting so that the teeth bite into the chain. Just a guess.

Brad

That's good to know. I thought I must have mucked up but as it was only minor I let it go. Glad I did otherwise I'd have been making a new adapter to no purpose.

My shifting is fine wobble and ll.

John Lewis

TheKid
12-18-2008, 10:43 PM
For what it's worth, the stationary rear cogs for Miami Sun trikes are made crooked. They all wobble, but have no real ill effects. I'm assuming this is a quality control issue, since the cogs are quite chincy.

darnthedog
04-30-2011, 06:02 PM
Sorry I dropped off the earth for a while. But I am starting my re entry into reality. Lost some one very dear and near to my heart and have not had the heart or mental capacity to continue the project. I am not looking for sypathy as it occured Dec 2008. Just explaining why no completion yet. But my other home projects are starting to be caught up and I will be re-starting this project. It it time to start living again. Mostly it has been work job eat sleep day in and day out half the week. The other half was sleep do laundry, eat sleep. Have not been doing much riding either on even a regular bike. But I gotta keep going or I won't live long.
So this is my announcement of coming back to the AZ crew. And glad you are still around. I have visitied from time to time but no driven interest due to the depression of loss.
Anyway Glad to be back. And thanks for all the support.

SirJoey
04-30-2011, 08:17 PM
Sorry for your loss DTD, but glad to have U back! :)



*** The **** Is My Shepherd! ***
http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/7131/sirjoeysigmedij1.gif
(Geezer & Bent Enthusiast At Large)

John Lewis
05-02-2011, 05:53 AM
Good to have you back DTD.
Hope things return to normal in time.

Look forward to seeing you working on a bike project.

John

darnthedog
10-19-2012, 08:12 AM
I am discontinuing this project to convert it to a Timberwolf. This was going to be a transport to work vehicle. But with the underseat steering and smaller front wheel which I had planned to begin with- So while it has been a while since I have updated this posting as I have been focusing on my Warrior which is at a stand still due to parts/cash ratio. That is a racing project. So I am moving this to Timberwold forum.