TM vs Momridian

[Patrike]

Hi

So I am looking to put my Kyoto on hold and take some time out and build a cumutter bike. I posted the thread here as GregLWB TM thread has influenced me somewhat even though I like the Meridrian looks more. I am getting to old to worry about looks - not that I had any :jester:but bike wise I want practical over looks and the TM shines - though I may do a little more reclined but love the front suspension so I want to go with that.

My cummute will be 33km one way and if you were following in Gregs other thread on the finished TM I was also asking about motor assist and debating dinosours vs Electrons. I want to average 40kph to bring my cummute under an hour -- 45min will be good.

Electric motor
Pros -- quiet, clean, effiecient
Cons -- lower range, high bat cost, slower speed

Gas motor
Pros -- great range, good speed,
Cons -- noisey, dirty,


So any and all input is apprecated.

[Patrike]

As per Locutus's advise - I have emailed the folks at ebikes to see if they have a kit that will fit my needs for my cummute. My goal is to have the cummuter up and running by end of July or sooner - 2 wheelers are easier builds and I will steal one of the seats I made for the Kyoto build. I am going to build with 2by1 1/16wall - should prove to be interesting. I have most parts now including a 26" and 20"(I think) front ends w/suspension depending if I go with TM or Meridian.

[TheKid]

If you use a hub motor on the rear wheel, a 36v 750 watt motor will do the trick. Using 18ah batteries will get you one way with power to spare, but you'd have to charge the batteries while you're at work. You can get 18ah sla's for about 30 bucks each. Bear in mind, they weigh 13 lbs. each. If you can't charge them while you're working, you'll need larger capacity batteries, or two lighter battery packs, Nimh or LiFePo4. You may have to deal with legalities if you plan on going 40 kph. (about 24 mph)

[Patrike]

If you use a hub motor on the rear wheel, a 36v 750 watt motor will do the trick. Using 18ah batteries will get you one way with power to spare, but you'd have to charge the batteries while you're at work. You can get 18ah sla's for about 30 bucks each. Bear in mind, they weigh 13 lbs. each. If you can't charge them while you're working, you'll need larger capacity batteries, or two lighter battery packs, Nimh or LiFePo4. You may have to deal with legalities if you plan on going 40 kph. (about 24 mph)

I will definately do not want to do the SLA route -- four one reason - if I have a fairler in the motor, contoller, anything with the power assist -- I have to peddle that thing home:rolleyes4: minimum I will go is ni-cad's

Your're right though - something in the 18ah area will be needed.

[Patrike]

Pat, in the spirit of "all input appreciated", I wouldn't assume that a small smogger would be better for the planet than a decent car engine. For example, I believe the typical lawn mower engine produces more emissions than a decent car engine, per hour, all things being equal. Electric is probably the best way to go environmentally. (Except possibly for the hydrocarbons they have to burn to generate the electricity at the power plant...) It's really not straight-forward which one is best. It may be best to just consider your performance needs, and take environmental issues out of the equation. Unless you find solid information somewhere comparing the two, and I haven't.
Danner

In particular hydrocarbons being produced from the power plant is a better solution -- from one source you can better control the output compared to thousands or millions!

As for the smogger/lawnmower vs car engine -- I would go with a 4 stroke motor - my understanding is it far cleaner than 2 strokes. All 4 strokes are same - just like the car engine - or should I say not any worse! Please correct me if I am wrong on that point as I am not that knowledgable in the area of small motors.

[Locutus]

I will definately do not want to do the SLA route -- four one reason - if I have a fairler in the motor, contoller, anything with the power assist -- I have to peddle that thing home:rolleyes4: minimum I will go is ni-cad's

Your're right though - something in the 18ah area will be needed.

I'm using a 48 volt 8 amp hour nicad pack, hoping it will take me 20 miles (32 KM?) per charge. This has yet to be tested, although results so far are excellent, having ridden it in my neighborhood this past week. I don't have the Cycle Analyst hooked up yet so I don't have speed and range numbers yet. I'll post them in my build thread when I have them. If I can go 20 miles on an 8 AH battery, it should be sufficient for your purposes also. 8 AH in a nicad pack will have roughly the equivalent range of a 12 AH, or even 16 AH lead acid pack, and weigh about 1/3 and be about 1/3 the size. Nicads can be completely discharged without damage, as opposed to lead acid, which shouldn't be discharged past 50%.

If the 8 AH nicad pack doesn't give me the range I need, I can buy another one and have a total of 16 AH for about the same cost as 12 AH NiMH or 10 AH lithium.

[Patrike]

Pat,
Your commute sounds very similar to mine, both in terms of distance and your speed and time goals. I spent considerable time trying to figure out the best combination to get me there. At first the eZee motor sounds like one of the most expensive options until you consider that it's a complete kit with all the electronics and hardware you need to make a quick conversion. Here in the Northwest I also had to consider wet weather, and the eZee components came out on top there as well. Plus, it's a more precision-built motor and perhaps more durable than the Crystalites, and made in free China (Taiwan), not Communist mainland China. It's also available in a rear wheel, disc brake version.

In deciding what you can afford, consider the two men who bought tools. The first bought inexpensive tools and was well pleased when he bought them, but not so much when he used them. The second man bought the best tools available and felt extravagant when he bought them, but well pleased when he used them.

So what are you using now and what are your prefromance #'s like?

[Locutus]

In particular hydrocarbons being produced from the power plant is a better solution -- from one source you can better control the output compared to thousands or millions!

As for the smogger/lawnmower vs car engine -- I would go with a 4 stroke motor - my understanding is it far cleaner than 2 strokes. All 4 strokes are same - just like the car engine - or should I say not any worse! Please correct me if I am wrong on that point as I am not that knowledgable in the area of small motors.

4 stroke engines are less polluting than 2 stroke in that 2 stroke uses fuel mixed with the engine lubricating oil, which is burned along with the fuel. But small 4 stroke engines can't compare with automotive engines because of all the computerized emission controls and electronic fuel injection common on modern cars.

[Patrike]

4 stroke engines are less polluting than 2 stroke in that 2 stroke uses fuel mixed with the engine lubricating oil, which is burned along with the fuel. But small 4 stroke engines can't compare with automotive engines because of all the computerized emission controls and electronic fuel injection common on modern cars.

So if put a catalytic converter it would be ok? :jester:

[TheKid]

I'm using a 48 volt 8 amp hour nicad pack, hoping it will take me 20 miles

Amperage draw is the key to figuring out how large a capacity you need. It helps to know if the wattage for a given motor is continuous or peak to determine the capacity that will fill your needs. I'm not sure about NiMh, but LiFePo4 batteries have slower discharge rate to make them safer, and some users report they had to go with higher capacity batteries in order for their 500w motors to work properly. Golden Motors recenty upgraded their 10ah LiFePo4 batteries to 12ah. I suspect it's because they upgraded their controllers to 50a, and there were some complaints about the batteries cutting out. My understanding is that 10ah LiFePo4 batteries should not be used with controllers that are rated higher than 20a.

[TheKid]

Also check out BMC kits. Very comparable to e-zee, waterproof controller, and available with NiCad or LiFePo4 batteries, for a lower price. Not cheap, but a bit more reasonable.

[GregLWB]

Hey Patrike,

My original intent on my commuter was to go electric but I ran into two problems. They say with electric you can go fast, go far, or go cheap - pick two. My first problem is that I work for a State Agency and so am unable to charge at work (with a 53 mile round trip that is important). The second issue was time. I too decided I needed to be able to ride in the upper 20's to make the commute work for me.

So I needed to go fast and go far so I couldn't go cheap. The gas setup cost me 1/4 of the price of an electric setup that would do the job for me and it only weighs 14 lbs. My motor is the cleanest burning small engine I have ever seen (I was a mechanic in the military and in the private sector) and I am really sensitive to CO emmisions (I have been CO poisoned on more multiple occasions) and any little exhaust leak on a vehicle really bothers me. My GEBE engine does not give me any problems in that way.

With all that said, I really like the motor setup on my two wheeled commuter but I am looking to put an electric setup on a trike when I build one for my winter commute.

On the tire sizes you were talking about, IMHO, you would be best off with dual 26" tires. In my experience you don't feel as much vibration on chip seal roads or cracks in the road. Good luck whatever you decide.:jester:

Greg

[Patrike]

I'm using a 48 volt 8 amp hour nicad pack, hoping it will take me 20 miles.

Justin from ebikes got back to me and is recommending the Nine Continents with the 48V ni-cad pack.

So have you been out riding with it yet - only hoping 20miles(32km) --hmmm, makes me wonder if this would be enough for me -- I have to recharge at work but it may not be be fully recharged for the trip home.

[GregLWB]

Justin from ebikes got back to me and is recommending the Nine Continents with the 48V ni-cad pack.

So have you been out riding with it yet - only hoping 20miles(32km) --hmmm, makes me wonder if this would be enough for me -- I have to recharge at work but it may not be be fully recharged for the trip home.

If you are going electric and don't want to worry about running out of juice you really need to plan 50% more capacity than what you need to do the trip (whether that is one way with at work charging or your round trip if you can't charge at work). If you do this and don't deeply discharge your batteries each time you use them they will last considerably longer.

Greg

[Patrike]

Hey Patrike,

My original intent on my commuter was to go electric but I ran into two problems. They say with electric you can go fast, go far, or go cheap - pick two. My first problem is that I work for a State Agency and so am unable to charge at work (with a 53 mile round trip that is important). The second issue was time. I too decided I needed to be able to ride in the upper 20's to make the commute work for me.

So I needed to go fast and go far so I couldn't go cheap. The gas setup cost me 1/4 of the price of an electric setup that would do the job for me and it only weighs 14 lbs. My motor is the cleanest burning small engine I have ever seen (I was a mechanic in the military and in the private sector) and I am really sensitive to CO emmisions (I have been CO poisoned on more multiple occasions) and any little exhaust leak on a vehicle really bothers me. My GEBE engine does not give me any problems in that way.

With all that said, I really like the motor setup on my two wheeled commuter but I am looking to put an electric setup on a trike when I build one for my winter commute.

On the tire sizes you were talking about, IMHO, you would be best off with dual 26" tires. In my experience you don't feel as much vibration on chip seal roads or cracks in the road. Good luck whatever you decide.:jester:

Greg

Interesting - I think at this point I am more concerned with the noise now more then the outpu of the tail pipe -it is a concern but not overly. I am looking at almost the same cost now based on the ebikes recommendation of the NC motor and 48V ni-cad. With the GE 35cc 4 stroke motor at 629 USD and the ebikes rig at close to 1000 cdn the cost are close when the conversion is done. And as I just posted to TheKid - not sure that the electric rig will make it a comfortable ride - I may run out of stored electrons on the way home.

I am leaning more and more towards the TM design for the 26 front wheel - just better for pot holes.

[Patrike]

I am pretty sure I like the sound of going with electric -- but the batteries are a kick in the b@!!s. I have been looking around -- making DIY packs do not look that hard and the savings is significant.

I found this site just looking around and it has a good deal on D size 10ah NiM cells - 16 cells to make 48v pack (assuming 3v cells which it did not say) for 114usd compared to 8ah pack of nicads for 330usd -- I think I can pay myself 200 to make them.

http://www.batteryjunction.com/16dni10reba.html


If anyone else has some insight on diy bat packs -- let me know.

[Locutus]

Justin from ebikes got back to me and is recommending the Nine Continents with the 48V ni-cad pack.

So have you been out riding with it yet - only hoping 20miles(32km) --hmmm, makes me wonder if this would be enough for me -- I have to recharge at work but it may not be be fully recharged for the trip home.

Ebikes offers two chargers that will work for the nicad packs. If you get the better one they say it will charge the battery in two hours, but I'd give it four.

I plan to test the range tomorrow, but since I've only charged the battery once since installing it on the trike, it hasn't been quite conditioned yet. I've heard that after several full charges the range will increase somewhat.

[TheKid]

Originally Posted by TheKid
I'm using a 48 volt 8 amp hour nicad pack, hoping it will take me 20 miles.

I was quoting Locutus. I'm using a 15ah sla pack.

I found this site just looking around and it has a good deal on D size 10ah NiM cells - 16 cells to make 48v pack (assuming 3v cells which it did not say) for 114usd

$114 for a NiM pack is a steal. I was going to try to make my own, but was told that in order to get a large enough capacity, they must be assembled in series-parallel, which I was told was dangerous if not done correctly. I didn't know they made 10ah cells. Thanks for the link.

[Locutus]

I am pretty sure I like the sound of going with electric -- but the batteries are a kick in the b@!!s. I have been looking around -- making DIY packs do not look that hard and the savings is significant.

I found this site just looking around and it has a good deal on D size 10ah NiM cells - 16 cells to make 48v pack (assuming 3v cells which it did not say) for 114usd compared to 8ah pack of nicads for 330usd -- I think I can pay myself 200 to make them.

http://www.batteryjunction.com/16dni10reba.html


If anyone else has some insight on diy bat packs -- let me know.

Looks like a good deal but before you buy them make sure you know what the "C" rate is. This refers to how much current you can draw from the cells. The higher the C rate, the better. Ebikes' nicads have a 5C rating, while most SLAs are closer to 1C. Most NiMH cells come in at 3C or less, although there are better ones out there. You can get lithiums from RC (radio control hobbyist) suppliers that have very high C rates but are also very expensive. Check the battery info page on the Ebikes.ca website for more information on battery chemistry.

[TheKid]

I just noticed they also have 12ah batteries. When I clicked to enlarge, I noticed they were 1.2v each. I'm assuming the other batteries are the same, since normal batteries are 1.5v. If so, the 16 pack would be 19.2v, so you'd need at least 40 to make a 48v pack.

[Patrike]

Looks like a good deal but before you buy them make sure you know what the "C" rate is. This refers to how much current you can draw from the cells. The higher the C rate, the better. Ebikes' nicads have a 5C rating, while most SLAs are closer to 1C. Most NiMH cells come in at 3C or less, although there are better ones out there. You can get lithiums from RC (radio control hobbyist) suppliers that have very high C rates but are also very expensive. Check the battery info page on the Ebikes.ca website for more information on battery chemistry.

yah -- they don't give full specs on batteries which concerns me.
I noticed that ebikes has 5C nicad cells - 9$/ea, 360$ to make a 48v pack but you can buy the pack for 375 -- not much savings for the DIY folks - in fact they should not even bother advertising them-imho.

[Patrike]

Here is a simple paint drawing of what I am thinking. 1x2" mainframe. Not sure if the steering will work out but I like the over all lines - chain run will be good. With a set of bags on the back I think it will be a nice looking ride. Don't be afraid to tell me you hate it, I want honest opions. Tell me what you would do diff based on this design -- cheers

[Patrike]

Here is a simple paint drawing of what I am thinking. 1x2" mainframe. Not sure if the steering will work out but I like the over all lines - chain run will be good. With a set of bags on the back I think it will be a nice looking ride. Don't be afraid to tell me you hate it, I want honest opions. Tell me what you would do diff based on this design -- cheers

Sorry - I ment to write 1x3" mainframe - was originally thinking thinking the 1 by 2 but there would be to much flex.

[TheKid]

I don't see why there'd be a problem with steering, other than excessive wheel flop if there's too much trail

[Locutus]

Pat,
I completed my 20-mile test run today. You can review my trip report here:

http://forum.atomiczombie.com/showthread.php?p=25869#post25869

[jimFPU]

FWIW I start saving for my GEBE today!! I can't wait. (Sorry Brad for boosting the smogger thing, but it's going to be cheaper/lighter for me for what I want.)

[mkane53]

Boy I keep eyeing those myself; I really like the way Greg's TM with the assist looks. And frankly with the kind of mileage you're talking about (up around 200 mpg advertised) it seems pretty good to me. But with me it's a "Want" and not a need for a long commute.

FWIW I start saving for my GEBE today!! I can't wait. (Sorry Brad for boosting the smogger thing, but it's going to be cheaper/lighter for me for what I want.)

[Patrike]

The commute -- I did a run with the car today on the route I hoped to be taking. The 1st 2/3's is glorious travel with a nice lined out side section -- the last 3rd is a stop and go traffic light nightmare - it took more time on that 3rd then the 1st 2/3's and there is no difined side section. I had been up that street before but I had not thought from the point of commuting - horrifying. I will try going back home tonight going up another street I have not been up in long time.

Motor -- I emailed Matt Shumaker about his electric kit's he was going to be bringing out for this spring -- unfortunately his excellent compact units are way out of my price range - I will have to save up for one of those.

Batteries -- not making much headway there either, everyone and his brother are selling batteries and everyone and their sisters are buying -- the prices for a good pack are just not practical yet.

I would think that I could have set up good electric assist for under 1k$ cdn at this point. But trying to do the right thing for the environment is hurting my wallet - and please, no tree hugging/hydrocarbon/saving money over time speaches - frustrating!!!!!!

[GregLWB]

The commutethe last 3rd is a stop and go traffic light nightmare - it took more time on that 3rd then the 1st 2/3's and there is no difined side section. I had been up that street before but I had not thought from the point of commuting - horrifying. I will try going back home tonight going up another street I have not been up in long time.

Yep, the route is key. I have found though that the areas with many lights is where I make up most of the difference in speed on my commute. I'm only going half as fast as the car but on the 26.5 mile one way it only takes 15 minutes longer on the bike in the afternoons. On the bike you can pace the lights better and you don't spend as much time as the cars do waiting.

Greg

[Patrike]

Yep, the route is key. I have found though that the areas with many lights is where I make up most of the difference in speed on my commute. I'm only going half as fast as the car but on the 26.5 mile one way it only takes 15 minutes longer on the bike in the afternoons. On the bike you can pace the lights better and you don't spend as much time as the cars do waiting.
Greg

Not so much the lights that are a concern but more the fact that that 1/3 part of the route has raised curbs with no extra space - I have no where to go if I am getting forced over by an irrate drive!

[GregLWB]

Not so much the lights that are a concern but more the fact that that 1/3 part of the route has raised curbs with no extra space - I have no where to go if I am getting forced over by an irrate drive!

If you can't find a better/safer route for that 1/3 I have some suggestions.

1 - What is the speed limit on that stretch? Remember that you are installing some type of motor assist (gas or electric) and that you will be able to sustain at least 20mph (pedalling and motor).

2 - Take the lane! If there is an itty, bitty shoulder you are much safer riding a couple of feet left of the line. I have a couple areas where this is necessary. If you ride right against the curb cars will try to 'squeeze' by and that is unsafe for everyone. If you take the lane they will have to pass you more like they would pass a car. A good site for commute info is www.commutebybike.com

3 - Be really visible! Little wimpy blinkies don't do the job. Use Planet Bike SuperFlash on the rear (maybe two) and they also make a 1 watt for the front. They are simply the brightest and most attention grabbing strobe pattern flashing lights I have ever seen (the rear one on my commuter lights up signs for about 3-4 blocks behind me).

Use a flag. I know they don't look as cool but you are commuting and the goal here is to get home alive. The flag helps when you are in city traffic as they can see it waving above the tops of cars. It also helps me on the highway as it is much higher than the top of my head and as a vehicle is coming over a small rise it helps them see me sooner.:scooter:

Greg

[Patrike]

If you can't find a better/safer route for that 1/3 I have some suggestions.

1 - What is the speed limit on that stretch? Remember that you are installing some type of motor assist (gas or electric) and that you will be able to sustain at least 20mph (pedalling and motor).

2 - Take the lane! If there is an itty, bitty shoulder you are much safer riding a couple of feet left of the line. I have a couple areas where this is necessary. If you ride right against the curb cars will try to 'squeeze' by and that is unsafe for everyone. If you take the lane they will have to pass you more like they would pass a car. A good site for commute info is www.commutebybike.com

3 - Be really visible! Little wimpy blinkies don't do the job. Use Planet Bike SuperFlash on the rear (maybe two) and they also make a 1 watt for the front. They are simply the brightest and most attention grabbing strobe pattern flashing lights I have ever seen (the rear one on my commuter lights up signs for about 3-4 blocks behind me).

Use a flag. I know they don't look as cool but you are commuting and the goal here is to get home alive. The flag helps when you are in city traffic as they can see it waving above the tops of cars. It also helps me on the highway as it is much higher than the top of my head and as a vehicle is coming over a small rise it helps them see me sooner.:scooter:

Greg

Good Info -- the nice thing is if I take the lane -- it is a double all the way so they can pass in the other lane without interferring with on coming traffic -- I will lookin at that link later -- I was planning on having sometype of bright indicators but had not looked into it - was hoping to find something that flashes as brite as my MIG -- with out the heat :jester:

[GregLWB]

I was planning on having sometype of bright indicators but had not looked into it - was hoping to find something that flashes as brite as my MIG -- with out the heat :jester:

According to my wife, the SuperFlash is brighter!:jester: She makes me put it in non flash mode when she is following me on the bike.:jester:

Greg

[mkane53]

Greg is absolutely right about claiming the lane. I live in suburban chicago and do 80% of my riding on roads with no dedicated bike lane. While it's a bit nerve-wracking at first, if you ride in the gutter or too closely to the curb, you're not doing either yourself or motor vehicles any favors. Since that's where all of the road-clutter, bottles, road-kill, etc. ends up if you ride too close to the right side of the road, you're going to end up having to swerve into traffic in order to avoid something in your path. That's bad.

You don't need to claim the entire lane, just place yourself within a foot or two from the right side of the road and cars will be able to get past you pretty easily and you'll have enough space to maneuver. I get yelled at very occasionally but the VAST majority of drivers give you the space you need.

One other visibility suggestion. They make Hi-Vis vests - like the road-crew guys wear - for bicyclists. You can usually pick them up at your LBS or online. It doesn't really help visibility from the rear because of the seats whe use, but helps tremendously for visibility from the front (cars turning into your lane from the right, etc.). They're especially effective as the light is failing ... exactly when your lights are least effective.

I've found that most of my problems with traffic come from the front. Cars turning left in front of me; cars coming in from the right, turning into my lane, etc. right in front of me (probably the most common). And occasionally the "Right Hook" where a car speeds up to get past you and then turns right ... right in front of you.

One last item of safety equipment is a really LOUD horn. I use an Airzound (http://www.amazon.com/Delta-Airzound-Bike-Horn/dp/B000ACAMJC) air horn - it scares the bejesus out of people - but get something that will get people's attention.

[Patrike]

One last item of safety equipment is a really LOUD horn. I use an Airzound (http://www.amazon.com/Delta-Airzound-Bike-Horn/dp/B000ACAMJC) air horn - it scares the bejesus out of people - but get something that will get people's attention.

What, my little ding - a - ling bell won't cut it !!!!

[Patrike]

How to send pedestrian's into shock.

Just purchase a Airzound horn and a Planet Bike SuperFlash bike flasher and when those pesky pedestrian's cross in front of you, get thier attention buy smiling and waving - when they look at you like your a stupid idiot - hit them with the sound and light show :jester:

[mkane53]

Exactly! First blind them with your flashing lights and then give them a heart attack with the air horn. They'll think they're about to be run over by a Mack Truck. That'll teach 'em.

How to send pedestrian's into shock.

Just purchase a Airzound horn and a Planet Bike SuperFlash bike flasher and when those pesky pedestrian's cross in front of you, get thier attention buy smiling and waving - when they look at you like your a stupid idiot - hit them with the sound and light show :jester:

[comreich]

Patrick, I second Greg's advice on taking the lane. There are still a few knobs who pass too close, but on the route I was using it wasn't too scary. The other reason for taking the lane is that the wheel-swallowing road cracks are typically on the edge of the outside lane, so I prefer to avoid those at all costs.

Hey, I don't need an AirZound to scare pedestrians. I've had so many incidents in the last week alone where I'm 200 feet off or so, call out that I'm "Passing left!" and have had two people crash into each other as they misjudge which direction left is :jester: Or the two ladies walking toward me obviously, not paying attention, so I yelled out a cheerful "Hello!". When I went by one of the women exclaimed that I had scared her :)

[TheKid]

I think my air-zounds was defective. It wasn't that loud. It was supposed to be 115db, but my OO-GAH horn, which is 115db, is much louder, and the neighbors with no sense of humor, and who I discovered, have a very colorful vocabulary, confirm it's not my imagination.

[Patrike]

I emailed Golden Eagle Bike engines -- I want to find out if I can get a 5/8" sprocket for my 1hp electric scott motor that will match there belts.

This scott motor is heavy but if I put my money into light weight batteries I will have componsated for that.

Is there a good speed ratio converter calculator out there -- I want to figure out for my 3000rpm motor what size drive wheel I need on the motor shaft to get upto 45kph - based on a picture on the GEBE site the wheel ring is aprx 16" in diameter - does that matter or do you just look at the wheel size --hmm, physics and math, new I should have paid more attention in those classes!

[GregLWB]

based on a picture on the GEBE site the wheel ring is aprx 16" in diameter - does that matter or do you just look at the wheel size --hmm, physics and math, new I should have paid more attention in those classes!

You're pretty darn close on your size guesstimate. I can't help you with the math though.

Greg

[Patrike]

You're pretty darn close on your size guesstimate. I can't help you with the math though.

Greg

Well - i give all the credit to the tape measure in the picture:jester: I found one rpm to speed calculator last night but I was not sure if it could be used in this application : http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_speed_rpm.htm

Engine speed -- 3000rpm
Transmission gear ration -- I guess that is the ratio of motor gear to tire gear say 16"over2" would be 8:1
Diff gear ratio -- not sure, main drive ring to wheel size 26"over16"=1.625:1
Load tire = 26"

So I get 35mph(56kph) -- now that's what I'm talking about -- I am probably not doing the numbers correctly and I will only really get 5kph:jester:

[GregLWB]

Well - i give all the credit to the tape measure in the picture:jester: I found one rpm to speed calculator last night but I was not sure if it could be used in this application : http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_speed_rpm.htm

Engine speed -- 3000rpm
Transmission gear ration -- I guess that is the ratio of motor gear to tire gear say 16"over2" would be 8:1
Diff gear ratio -- not sure, main drive ring to wheel size 26"over16"=1.625:1
Load tire = 26"

So I get 35mph(56kph) -- now that's what I'm talking about -- I am probably not doing the numbers correctly and I will only really get 5kph:jester:



I'm not sure on that one and will take your word for the math, but on my TourMaster with dual 26" wheels (Schwalbe Marathon Plus 26 x 1.75 tires at 70 psi) and using the 60 tooth chainring on the front and an 11 tooth on the rear I have hit 36.4mph on a flat w/no wind (Pedalling somewhere in the 90-100 rpm range). I usually back off the motor and pedal easier on my commute and try to stay right at 28-29 mph.:)

Greg

[Patrike]

I'm not sure on that one and will take your word for the math, but on my TourMaster with dual 26" wheels (Schwalbe Marathon Plus 26 x 1.75 tires at 70 psi) and using the 60 tooth chainring on the front and an 11 tooth on the rear I have hit 36.4mph on a flat w/no wind (Pedalling somewhere in the 90-100 rpm range). I usually back off the motor and pedal easier on my commute and try to stay right at 28-29 mph.:)
Greg

If I can peak 45-50kph (27-31mph) and can cruise at 40kph(24mph) without too much leg work, i will be a happy camper

[Patrike]

I tried another route today coming into work by car -- actually tried 2 streets on the south/north bound portion of the trip. I went down one -- then went east some more to the next major steet and head south again. Much better on the last 3rd of it today, in that there were fewer lights. I will have a small portion where I have only one lane (One each direction) and forcing a bottle neck with the cars when I pronounce myself there but then it actually opens to a portion of 3 lanes each way -- and the traffic was lite, well today it was. Every street south on the last 3rd of the route goes to a high curb with no extra space, so I will have to just deal with it and demand space and reunit with my faith in the good Lord.

On that one lane portion today there was actually a cyclist there and the cars were very repectful and generous, slowing down and giving lots of space -- he was riding moutain bike, on the edge of the road however - I will demand a little more as per the advice here. Another thing at this one lane point was a bigass hill - saw the cyclist putting into low and starting to work up that hill -- man, I am hoping to be grinning like crazy monkey my 1st climb up that hill - this will be the longest and steapest hill on the route.

[GregLWB]

I tried another route today coming into work by car -- actually tried 2 streets on the south/north bound portion of the trip. I went down one -- then went east some more to the next major steet and head south again. Much better on the last 3rd of it today, in that there were fewer lights. I will have a small portion where I have only one lane (One each direction) and forcing a bottle neck with the cars when I pronounce myself there but then it actually opens to a portion of 3 lanes each way -- and the traffic was lite, well today it was. Every street south on the last 3rd of the route goes to a high curb with no extra space, so I will have to just deal with it and demand space and reunit with my faith in the good Lord.

Sounds like you have a plan now.:) One thing I forgot to add in the commuting recommendations earlier was mirrors. I can't stress enough that if you are going to be out there with cars on a recumbent you need mirrors. You will still need to turn your head before turning or changing lanes but the mirrors will help you to pace the traffic and see holes that will allow you to smooth out and destress your ride.

Also if the worst case scenarios occured it would allow you to see when it might be more advisable to run into the ditch or the curb rather than have a close encounter with a larger motor vehicle. Usually with mirrors you can see 'a case of stupid' developing soon enough that you can very easily avoid 'close calls'. At least that has been my experience.:jester:

Greg

[Patrike]

Sounds like you have a plan now.:) One thing I forgot to add in the commuting recommendations earlier was mirrors. I can't stress enough that if you are going to be out there with cars on a recumbent you need mirrors. You will still need to turn your head before turning or changing lanes but the mirrors will help you to pace the traffic and see holes that will allow you to smooth out and destress your ride.
Also if the worst case scenarios occured it would allow you to see when it might be more advisable to run into the ditch or the curb rather than have a close encounter with a larger motor vehicle. Usually with mirrors you can see 'a case of stupid' developing soon enough that you can very easily avoid 'close calls'. At least that has been my experience.:jester:
Greg

Yep -- I was thinking of that, thanks. I was also wondering about in the future having one of those rear view back up cameras as well as mirrors - the one I have seen that my brother has was a pretty crapy picture due to the wireless transfer though - maybe when they make them better or find a cheap hardwired one. I could take my cheap vid camera -- flip the veiwer 180 with the carmera pointed backwards:jester: and record where I been!!!

[GregLWB]

Yep -- I was thinking of that, thanks. I was also wondering about in the future having one of those rear view back up cameras as well as mirrors - the one I have seen that my brother has was a pretty crapy picture due to the wireless transfer though - maybe when they make them better or find a cheap hardwired one. I could take my cheap vid camera -- flip the veiwer 180 with the carmera pointed backwards:jester: and record where I been!!!

LOL! As funny as that is, it would at least help the cops find the hit and run driver after the fact!:jester: You could also add a back up beeper and some of those chrome 'curb feelers'. HaHaHa!:jester:

Greg