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socialtalker
04-16-2010, 04:47 AM
its time for me to start buying stuff. after getting a quote of having the frame made, it was just too expensive, so i will have to make it myself. i decided on gas. i found a seller of gas tanks on craigs list and this weekend i will rent a truck and pick them up. i am rather scared about it all. these tanks sound terrifying to deal with. but electricity might endanger the house
i can seem to find out exactly how to transport these tanks, i just know, it must be an open air truck, so i have to rent a truck. they should be chained down. is it okay to lay them down in a regular truck for transport or must they always be vertical?

savarin
04-16-2010, 06:58 AM
its time for me to start buying stuff. after getting a quote of having the frame made, it was just too expensive, so i will have to make it myself. i decided on gas. i found a seller of gas tanks on craigs list and this weekend i will rent a truck and pick them up. i am rather scared about it all. these tanks sound terrifying to deal with. but electricity might endanger the house
i can seem to find out exactly how to transport these tanks, i just know, it must be an open air truck, so i have to rent a truck. they should be chained down. is it okay to lay them down in a regular truck for transport or must they always be vertical?

I am assuming you are talking about oxy-acetylene tanks, hopefully with hoses,gauges and welding torch.
I dont know the ins and outs where you live but can you own the tanks?
Here we can only hire them from a gas company who re-fill them.
Are the tanks being sold in test? else you will have to re-test them and they may fail.
Dont forget flashback arrestors. and yes its better to never lay them down.
Definitely do not lay the acetylene tanks down as they are full of acetone and another filler to prevent any large voids of pure acetylene.

Racer46
04-16-2010, 08:58 AM
If you havenít bought the gas welding kit yet, donít do it. Gas welding is an art and takes a lot of practice before you are good at it. MIG welding can be done by anyone who isnít blind and is of average intelligence. An acceptable weld can be made with just a small amount of practice. I hadnít touched a welder since high school auto shop, about 40 years ago (an arc welder that I think I used twice and was not good at it) and I was able to stick 2 pieces of metal together in less than an hour. Harbor Freight has a flux core MIG welder for under $100, PM me with your address and Iíll send you a coupon for another 20% off. They also carry a decent auto darkening helmet and welders gloves. The only other thing you will need is a welderís jacket. MIG puts out a lot of UV light and will give you a nasty sun burn if youíre not covered. It also throws off some hot sparks that you donít want landing on your skin. I picked mine up at a welding supply store but if youíve got a cotton denim jacket that will work for starters. You should have less than $200 invested in your welding equipment when youíre done

Some of the welding resources Iíve read say to learn gas welding first, after that everything else is easy. Thatís great if you want to be a professional welder. I donít and I donít think you do either. I just want to be able to reliably stick 2 pieces of mild steel together. This site is a good primer on MIG welding. http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/
After you digest that, go to your work area and lay down a few beads with your new welder.

I wouldnít be afraid of electric welding. You have many electric appliances in your house that are almost as dangerous as a welder. Your grinder is going to put out more sparks than the welder will. Just follow a few safety rules. Work in a well ventilated area. Keep flammable substances about 5í away from where you are welding. (That said I weld on a wooden work bench) Wear proper protective gear, molten metal is hot. Donít let spectators look at the welding arc.

Savarin, I donít know about other states but in Florida you can purchase the tank. Thatís kind of a misnomer as when you go back for a refill they exchange the tank, you donít get yours back.

greenevegiebeast
04-16-2010, 11:45 AM
Assuming that you will not be using Monster commercial size tanks. transportation is rather easy.

First rule. DON'T REMOVE THE TANKS TILL YOU GET THEM TO YOUR WORK SITE. They are their to prevent the valve assemble from getting damaged, or catastrophically removed from the tanks. decides they make cool door knockers.

Second Rule. secure the tanks while traveling. for reason see rule one.

Always remember the contents in said tanks are under pressure, and their fore present a hazard in and of them selves.

That said for bike building and general welding i prefer MIG, tig, or stick welding. heat control is easer. better penetration in thicker metals, less warping issues.

taytayou812
04-16-2010, 12:19 PM
I have to agree with Pete (Racer46), gas welding or even brazing is much harder to do and takes much longer to master compared to welding. These cheap / inexpensive flux core wire feed welders from Harbor Freight Tool or where ever, are so easy to use and really quick to learn and make strong welds in a very short time. I started this last summer after a very long absence from any metal working(back in high school(garuated in 1980)) and in just an afternoon, I was making strong welds and they looked pretty good too. The ones that didn't cleaned up with a little grinding. Just my two cents worth. -Taylor-

Radical Brad
04-16-2010, 12:37 PM
I was formerly trained on Oxy, and did a lot of frame building way back. I would say that my beginner stick welding was still stronger and more reliable than my best tank welds!

Brad

socialtalker
04-18-2010, 02:28 AM
thanks to all for responding. the book i am reading agrees with everyone that mig welding is the easiest to get a master of. however, i still want gas because its my understanding i can bend and cut metal, and its supposed to be slower than the other kinds of welding, which i think i might work better with, i dont know why.
however instead of the craigslist buy, i decided to order and have empty tanks shipped to my home instead of picking them up, i will worry about getting them filled later. i plan to start practicing sometime in may.if i cant do good welds with the gas, i will go the mig route,


If you havenít bought the gas welding kit yet, donít do it. Gas welding is an art and takes a lot of practice before you are good at it.

socialtalker
04-18-2010, 02:34 AM
thanks! i will definitely keep that in mind when i get them filled.


Assuming that you will not be using Monster commercial size tanks. transportation is rather easy.

First rule. DON'T REMOVE THE TANKS TILL YOU GET THEM TO YOUR WORK SITE. They are their to prevent the valve assemble from getting damaged, or catastrophically removed from the tanks. decides they make cool door knockers.

Second Rule. secure the tanks while traveling. for reason see rule one....

John Lewis
04-18-2010, 10:06 AM
If this is oxy acetylene DO get some instruction on setting up, pressures that sort of thing. Do it wrong and it can be very dangerous. There is a proper sequence and method to lighting up and closing down the torch and bottles.

I use oxy for brazing on frames. I've not tried fusion welding.

John Lewis

greenevegiebeast
04-18-2010, 02:21 PM
i havnt oxy welded in 20 years, i much prefer mig.

socialtalker
04-19-2010, 10:58 PM
yes, i am learning that. i am spending the next few weeks learning before i do anything. thanks!


If this is oxy acetylene DO get some instruction on setting up, pressures that sort of thing. Do it wrong and it can be very dangerous. There is a proper sequence and method to lighting up and closing down the torch and bottles.

I use oxy for brazing on frames. I've not tried fusion welding.

John Lewis

vrooom3440
04-20-2010, 12:37 PM
It is very true that the gas welding rig is more versatile than the MIG process. You can cut with it. You can braze or solder with it. And you can weld with it.

I learned welding with a gas setup. I don't know what the volume of the tanks was, but a 4 foot tall acytelene tank can last quite a long time. The little tanks in the plastic carrier from Home Depot run out much faster. I think of them as a few jobs and refill.

I was taught that you ALWAYS have the caps screwed on over the valves whenever you move these. Myth Busters did a segment on how powerful these things are and the tank went right through a reinforced concrete block wall. Treat with much respect.

The welding flame is not as bright with gas as the arc is with MIG so you can use a lighter goggle tint. Makes it easier to see what is happening and the process is slower.

Always turn the fuel off before the oxygen when shutting down. That keeps your tips cleaner.

Actually owning tanks is pretty unusual these days. Most are rented and thus owned by the gas supplier. They get pretty particular about tank ownership. If you own you also have to have them periodically pressure tested before refill.

Having done both MIG and gas... the MIG is certainly quicker but I still wish I could figure out where to keep my gas setup in my garage instead of in my *other* garage 100 miles away. There are some areas where brazing would be the cats meow over welding.

socialtalker
04-23-2010, 11:03 PM
thanks for the tips! i am renting some videos that that smartflix place, they have a full set of welding videos, and of course youtube. i think i might try to get a flux mig welder from harborfreight to do tack welding and save on my gas tanks. havent gotten those filled up yet anyway. just collecting parts. i got nearly all my steel now from a well know place here in detroit, federal pipe. dont know if they have the best prices, but they are in my neighborhood and have a good rep.

It is very true that the gas welding rig is more versatile than the MIG process. You can cut with it. You can braze or solder with it. And you can weld with it.

I learned welding with a gas setup. I don't know what the volume of the tanks was, but a 4 foot tall acytelene tank can last quite a long time. The little tanks in the plastic carrier from Home Depot run out much faster. I think of them as a few jobs and refill.

I was taught that you ALWAYS have the caps screwed on over the valves whenever you move these. Myth Busters did a segment on how powerful these things are and the tank went right through a reinforced concrete block wall. Treat with much respect.

The welding flame is not as bright with gas as the arc is with MIG so you can use a lighter goggle tint. Makes it easier to see what is happening and the process is slower.

Always turn the fuel off before the oxygen when shutting down. That keeps your tips cleaner.

Actually owning tanks is pretty unusual these days. Most are rented and thus owned by the gas supplier. They get pretty particular about tank ownership. If you own you also have to have them periodically pressure tested before refill.

Having done both MIG and gas... the MIG is certainly quicker but I still wish I could figure out where to keep my gas setup in my garage instead of in my *other* garage 100 miles away. There are some areas where brazing would be the cats meow over welding.