400 pound man needs trike

IRF

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AZ has everything... it's just a matter of finding it! Now I can have the adapters made.

Just got 4 bikes given to me for additional parts.

I'm Bound and determined to get BENT
 
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this might work for you ?



This delta uses standard MTB front forks for the rear end ?



If they were spread to take some rear wheels with disc's and single speed free wheels it would just be a matter of making the layshaft with a cassette and 2 more free wheels to get 2wd ?



regards Paul
 

IRF

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Bought and downloaded 6 sets of plans last night, ordered some parts online... still hunting a few more bikes to scavenge...

Building to commence soon!
 
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If they were spread to take some rear wheels with disc's and single speed free wheels it would just be a matter of making the layshaft with a cassette and 2 more free wheels to get 2wd ?



regards Paul
[/QUOTE]
If the forks were rotated clockwise around the axle for about 90 degrees, it would result in a much shorter delta, support much more weight and withstand much more strain from the brakes. The mounting against the frame here might also be a weak point and forks with suspension would be another bonus.

These modifications might even interest me in making a delta.
 

Radical Brad

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It almost sound like you want to make this!



Two things I can honestly say avoid...

  1. Two wheel drive on a delta trike.
  2. Any part of the fork design trike shown in your last photo.
We have gone over 2WD often in this forum and the old one, so I will just keep it short and say... it is complex, expensive, and accomplishes zero.

As far as the fork trike design... not going to hold up. No way, no how.

Brad
 
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That could be one of the problems with finding a picture on the web with no reference and feedback from what happened after it was put together.

One of the reasons I run my thread like a diary ' warts and all !!'

There are plenty of other examples of trikes with a similar concept :-



This is lean steer but it does not have to be ?
 

IRF

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We have gone over 2WD often in this forum and the old one, so I will just keep it short and say... it is complex, expensive, and accomplishes zero
Brad, I completely understand that compared to me, I am a kindergartener in the world of trikes compared to you being THE Doctor... So please don't take this wrong as I'm really trying to understand and end up with a successful build that fits my specific needs.

I really have only rode one adult trike. It was a upright delta. It was one speed, one wheel drive. To peddle down the road was a constant fight to keep it from pushing itself into the ditch and it didn't matter if it was flat or hill, it wanted to go to The ditch every time.

The reality is due to some of the damage from a motorcycle accident I can't tolerate that continual pressure especially on my hands without excruciating pain. I don't know what caused that excessive push in the steering and don't want to duplicate it in my build. In my mind at least a significant portion was the 1wd.

Here are a few of my issues I'm trying to resolve or at least move to be more friendly to this broken bodied 400 pound guy, in my build and I appreciate your wisdom in any of them.

Pain has caused me to become very inactive. Standing and walking are often big problems as is riding an upright bike. My thought, go recumbent.

While balance isn't to bad on an upright, my coordination and balance I fear would cause problems on a 2 wheel recumbent. My thought, go recumbent trike.

Ongoing vibration and even mild continual resistance on my arms and hands are excruciating, not just at the time of the occurrence, but often days or weeks later. I need to be able to truly relax my arms and hands as i ride. My thought reduce steering pull through 2wd and add as much anti vibration as I can figure out.

Sitting on a hard surface is seldom a good thing, even if somewhat padded. My though a mesh seat.

I know there is no perfect answers but reading and looking at plans, tutorials etc... both here and other sites I believe:
2wd would be worth the cost for my situation (if not help me understand)... and if 2wd, then 2 rear disc brakes.

Underseat steering to keep arms at most natural position using heavy foam sleeves on bars to help dampen vibration.

Mesh style seat (I've ordered the heavy phifertex from a sail cloth supplier and plan on 3/4" conduit side rails barnet style with 4 horizontal members instead of 2 unless someone knows of something better...

Deltawolf is my desired general build style, planning a double rear spring/shock suspension due to my weight. Was hoping to avoid front suspension only because what I have is in that fashion is all kid bike suspension forks, I just don't think it would hold up. My hope is the rear suspension will ease major bumps and at least reduce the harsh jolt on me and my trike.

I'm interested in the Doctor Brads experience along with others on here at AZ.. Again, I'm heading for a beefed up deltawolf design... not that I don't appreciate the efforts and pictures of the others but I'm secure in moving forward with a beefed deltawolf...

Thanks
 

Radical Brad

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When I have time I will add "Differential Drive" as a tutorial to explain the pros, cons, and misunderstandings that often go along with the term.

Here is my condensed version for now...

The term "differential drive" refers to a mechanical system that allows the wheel on the inside of the turn to drive at a rate lesser than the wheel on the outside, which is required so that there is no skidding or wheel drag happening . Here is a great article to read...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_(mechanical_device)

So my first point shall be... "you are probably NOT referring to an actual differential".

Any trike you have seen with dual rear wheel drive is most likely NOT a differential, but in fact a "ratcheting drive".
The great video Twinkle just posted is a perfect example of a ratchet drive. That is NOT a differential drive.

A ratchet drive is completely different than a differential, so much in fact, that is actually does the opposite, making only the wheel on the inside of the turn do all of the work. The reason is because the other wheel is turning faster, engaging the ratchet, which disengages the drive via the pawls.

A ratchet drive therefor has no real use on a trike, as the only time both wheels are "driven" is when going in a 100% straight line.
Some may argue that "but I need the grip", but this is totally false. I dare you to spin your trike tires!

Now back to the "true differential". These are complext and VERY expensive to make, as those who have pulled the cover off their auto diff. can attest to. There are a lot of moving parts, and to this date I have ever only seen one made for bicycle usage, and it was a beast made for rickshaws.

Ok, so lets recap up to here...

1) There are no true differential drives available for trikes.
2) Ratcheting drive offers no advantages whatsoever.


I am not saying this just from googling the subject either. I have bult many ratchet drive trikes, including that funny 1982 car seat trike I posted in my last response. Ratchet drive does work, but has no advantages over one wheel drive at all.

So to answer what is usually the last question... "but won't my trike push to one side with only one wheel drive?"

Nope.
There is absolutely no noticeable effect on steering or forward movement on any single wheel driven trike or quad.
If you rode each one you could not tell the difference. No way, no how.

So this leaves only one answer.... not worth the cost of effort.

I will do this in much more detail later, showing some diagrams of both types of drives as they move around corners and such.

Now having said all of that... build it anyway, post photos, and then your ride report, that's what DIY is all about!!
If I had not built several myself, I would still do so after reading all of this. Just like a rear steer bike (other can of worms)!

Brad
 

IRF

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Brad I appreciate your detailed response. What then would/ could the culprit have been on that upright delta trike? I mean i was not imagining the problem as everyone on that thing experienced it. Frame length? Tires? I might actually be able to get to look at it in the coming week. Given my physical issues is the reason/necessity for wanting to figure this out, not to drive you crazy as it may seem.

The reality is you are right that I was heading for a ratchet drive. So in comparison of 1wd and ratchet 2wd that you have built, tested, rode... if you are peddling and let go of the handlebars neither unit will pull to the side? How about when you did not get to down shift and you are forced to start out hard, no pull from either design?

The zero effect is not only being questioned because of my personal experience but I work with special needs kids as well. Three of them have adult upright delta trikes and none of them ride them because of the pull, for them mentally they can not grasp the need to compensate for the pull... for me I don't think I could physically compensate very long if required.

Thanks for helping me work through this in my head...
 

Radical Brad

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Perhaps this is an upright issue?
I will admit that being "Bent for life" I have very little experience with anything "upright".

I could see an upright trike, aka "Granny Shopper" having some drive induced steer. With such a high center of gravity, the load (rider), would tend to sway. Not really sure though, I am just guessing.

But I can tell you that whatever problems a granny shopper has with single wheel, it will have it the same with ratchet drive. Actually, it will be twice as bad because you are ALWAYS only driving the inner circle wheel now.

I will have to let you experiment now, but will say that not one of the Delta Trikes I have made has any drive induced steer, and they are all single wheel drive. Even the DeltaRunner has none of this, and it is fairly upright.

I try to keep my upcomming DIY projects "under wraps" for NewsLetters, but I can tell you that this year I am building a Trike called "The Motivator", and it will be a Tadpole style trike with a 500 pound capacity. The Motivator is being created for those who have stated exactly what you have... "400 Pound Man Needs a Trike". The goal is a robust trike that looks good, rides good, has somewhat upright seating, and does not look like a Granny Shopper! Basically a beefed up StreetFox with a boat or car seat.

Brad
 

Twinkle

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Sitting at the back of my garage is a PFAU tec diff unit , this is a 100% diff unit in its own frame , It has been sitting there since 2015 when I started the "project 2016 velo " this is a diff without a free wheel and I have built a braked jackshaft for it .
Don't ask how much they are ! hence why it is still sitting here , On day it will be used but it will become a loss leader on whatever project it goes on .
The velo project is permanently shelved due to the main workshop being relocated after mums sad departure almost 9 months ago .



regards emma
 
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To Twinkle: There are single speed and 7 speed ratchet drives on Fleabay. Search for "bicycle to tricycle conversion" Stating a $155, shipping $45??!

To Brad : My granny shopper spins the drive wheel when it hits a bump. May also be caused by gravel road. I rode it about a dozen times.

Jeffstuff!
 

Radical Brad

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I found a "Worksman" trike once as well (Granny shopper), and it did the same thing. Even a slight turn make the wheel spin a bit.
Odd though, on our DelaRunner Trike, this does not happen at all, and it is somewhat higher as far as bent trikes go....



I guess even the extra 12 or so inches of forward height of the rider is enough to make them so unstable.

I ended up chopping up the Worksman Trike into something much less ridable!...



Oddly, the 10 rider trike was not "tippy", but you needed a 2 lane street to make a corner!

Brad
 

SirJoey

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My cozy little nook in the corner!
LOVE the DeltaRunner! Bought the plans for that one too,
& really had planned to build it, but alas, I ran out of time.
Given the ways & means though, I would STILL build it! :)

***
 

IRF

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Update. 400 pound man still needs trike. Summer got way to complicated with automotive repairs. I have 90% of everything I need. Still need machine work done for my disc brake to 3/4" keyed axles and adapter for rear sprocket set. Then the parts for the rear wheels. I have contacted 7 bike shops within 100 miles of home and none are interested in helping with my rear wheels once my axle hubs are welded up (at any price). I've never been good at truing a wheel, so the idea of starting from scratch and figuring out what spokes and rims is spooking me a bit...
 
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