Another FWD Delta trike.

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I though everyone did that ....... till I met you and John that is :whistle:
No, just you. ;) The rest of us "wing-it" and hope to God we can buy whatever we need, when we need to. NB, this does not work for re-welding snapped off bits on a Wonky-Donkey. :(
Is that counting the banana bags ?
Nope they were extra "just-in-case" storage and for carrying the 3 bottles of wine the Tonic and the Litre of Vodka back to camp each night. ;)
 
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As requested I dragged the Python out of it's parking spot (stood against the workshop wall) and put the seat on it for a better idea of "interferences".

This shot shows a 46L box tucked into the space between the rear wheels (32.5" track).


Using that as a platform (there is currently no rear racking) I put a 30L pannier, stuffed with the wife's finest scatter-cushions. Side and rear views.




And here is that 46L crate (stood on a paint pot) in the same location for comparison.



I think an enterprising person could make a frame for crate/pannier stashing and get all they needed for a trip into the space if they really tried hard.
Alternatively.......
Change the rear section of the trike for a lowered X-Beam and increase the space and place the load lower to improve the CoG?

 
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Dan

I did a similar thing with the Mk2 Python rear end.



A sort of reverse bike pannier rack , there were a couple of reasons for it ending up this shape ?

My panniers opened like yours it was much safer to have them pointing inwards so any hanging straps/buckles did not get in the rear wheels.
It stopped the rear wheels throwing water into the tops of the panniers.
A lot easier to open the panniers as the tops went over the wheels instead of if they were back to back where they would obstruct each other.
My home panniers at that time where cheap Ebay ones and quite hard to mount dismount hence the solution.

It looks to me like if you panniers were just rewards about 4" they would drop behind your rear axle and so could be lower by about 5" ?
For camping that would work and seems less work than dropping the whole of that axle which works fine ? so it looks like mine ?

Paul
 
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Dan

I did a similar thing with the Mk2 Python rear end.



A sort of reverse bike pannier rack , there were a couple of reasons for it ending up this shape ?

My panniers opened like yours it was much safer to have them pointing inwards so any hanging straps/buckles did not get in the rear wheels.
It stopped the rear wheels throwing water into the tops of the panniers.
A lot easier to open the panniers as the tops went over the wheels instead of if they were back to back where they would obstruct each other.
My home panniers at that time where cheap Ebay ones and quite hard to mount dismount hence the solution.

It looks to me like if you panniers were just rewards about 4" they would drop behind your rear axle and so could be lower by about 5" ?
For camping that would work and seems less work than dropping the whole of that axle which works fine ? so it looks like mine ?

Paul
I see what you are driving at, but.... as the rear bit is suspended it has no vertical members to bolt a rack/frame to and it cannot be attached to the seat back spar because of the suspension movement.
Doing what you did on your Mk2 does provide a pair of points that you could mount to. I will think about the options available for fixing a rigid frame for panniers to what is there. :)
 
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I see what you are driving at, but.... as the rear bit is suspended it has no vertical members to bolt a rack/frame to and it cannot be attached to the seat back spar because of the suspension movement.
No this was once suspended just like yours ? see the hole in the main frame between the axle and the forward brace mountings ? Non of my pannier mountings were on the suspended part.

Doing what you did on your Mk2 does provide a pair of points that you could mount to. I will think about the options available for fixing a rigid frame for panniers to what is there. :)
The front pannier mounts just happened to be shorter than yours would be because of the vertical axle mounts , on yours you don't even need to drop the axle as the panniers can sit behind the axle.

Something like this should cover it ?



Blue parts could be 1/2" or maybe 10mm tubing [ you have a bender ] room to mount 2 panniers and the tent on top , like a normal bike rack however yours has a suspension unit inside it.
Could even be Q/R'ed on [ I know you like them :LOL: ] only 4 attachments.
In fact looking at it if you omitted the lower rear ' bumper style ' piece the lower mounting points of the 2 rear most stays could be taken directly back to the axle inside the pannier gap at the width of the tent support , total width - 2 x pannier size front to back ?

Paul
 
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After a long chat with Paul this morning I had a think on the adjustable width issue and the work involved etc. etc.

As ever, Paul's pragmatism and common-sense was countering my headlong rush to build stuff (because we can ;) )

I can (obviously) make a 24” track (28” total width) rear X-beam to fit the existing Python frame that allows the trike to be wheeled down the side of the house.

I can also make a common QR/Bolt-on rack/carrier to fit the current rear end AND any future rear end to allow me to take it shopping and for weekend (or longer) trips.
Something else that occurred to me was that with the QR attached Sturmey wheels & hubs the rear wheels are very easy to swap over from 20" to 24".

Now, my rushing ahead has been all about making use of those 24" wheels with the fat tyres possibly on a whole new frame, and Paul was questioning the need for yet another trike when I have storage issues already.

The upshot is that I could have a common frame and swap the back wheels over between 20/24".......But what about the front end?

Then I remembered that my existing PPP provides a common carrier to which a “front-end” frame gets bolted.

So all (yes of course “all” is a small word for a lot of work) I have to do is make a 24” front section to bolt onto my PPP (4-Bolts correctly spaced in the right places).

Talking of a 24" front frame; I rummaged around in the workshop roof-space and found a suspension bike rear frame for a 24" wheel.


So here is the PPP area of my Python in the picture below (parked vertically against the wall of my tiny workshop.
My silly mistake was to mount the handlebars to the front removable section that is part of the front forks/frame (instead of the rear permanent PPP section).
That is fairly easy to fix I think.



So I need to make another bolt-on framework that attaches to the PPP frame and then weld my 24” front wheel’s frame to that.
At least that’s how it looks to me right now.

Taking the Python apart to prove it can all be done may reveal something else entirely and WILL take the Python out of commission for a while.

But like the old BT advert used to say... "It's good to talk" because it makes you think about "other options".

Later folks! :D
 
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Dan

That looks a good starting point.

However the real reason for you stalling to build the next trike has not been divulged ?

You are waiting for the northern guinea pig to prove/disprove that with a 24" track rear end and a 18" high seat you need to tilt to get around corners safely ?

Crash test dummy suit in wash , however soon be wearable again !

Paul
 
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Dan

That looks a good starting point.

However the real reason for you stalling to build the next trike has not been divulged ?

You are waiting for the northern guinea pig to prove/disprove that with a 24" track rear end and a 18" high seat you need to tilt to get around corners safely ?

Crash test dummy suit in wash , however soon be wearable again !

Paul
I wanted to spare your blushes.....honest! :ROFLMAO:
I took another look at the existing Python and I think there is a key dimension I can use to make my life easier when making a 24" front frame.
The BB axle is exactly 685mm from the centre of the fixed seat mount, so staying in this "orbit" should result in success.
It may mean the BB axle is a little higher though. But 20 - 24 inches is only 2" radius difference. But I can raise the seat by almost 2" too on elastomers can't I Paul? ;)
 
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Some steel was mangled and electrons press ganged into forming a warming breeze for said steel and some filler rod.


This is the start of a new front frame/triangle for the Python.
A "Shortness of Legs" issue will probably mandate that the Bottom Bracket ends up on the riders side of the axle and a little higher than I would normally like, but we are not there yet so I don't know for sure.
 
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It may mean the BB axle is a little higher though. But 20 - 24 inches is only 2" radius difference.
Err no ? because it is the whole wheel i.e the potential for 2" between pivot and axle and 2" between axle and BB when I was at school that was 4" ?

But I can raise the seat by almost 2" too on elastomers can't I Paul? ;)
You can raise the seat just as high as you want matey , however I would stop if the nose bleeds prove to be persistent :D

Paul
 
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A "Shortness of Legs" issue will probably mandate that the Bottom Bracket ends up on the riders side of the axle and a little higher than I would normally like, but we are not there yet so I don't know for sure.
Wow into uncharted territory there mate , good luck.

Paul
 
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